Irfan Yusuf in his blog (Supplication without hijab. Jan.) claimed clitoridectomy is a pre-Islamic Indonesian custom:“Perhaps our imams can remind Indonesian imams that not all vestiges of Indonesia's indigenous pre-Islamic customs are worth holding onto.”
..and Yusuf Islam/Cat Stevens (Feb) claimed Islam doesn’t ban playing musical instruments and was peaceful—HA,HA. Both are lying! Is the problem their name or their religion? Surely Islam doesn’t support lying to promote Islam...well, YES IT DOES! No doubt both earned ‘allah’ points, another virgin perhaps???
Irfan Yusuf (Muslim commentator, writer eg al-Age): Irfan’s attempt to blame ancient Indonesian culture for clitoridectomy is grossly offensive to the initial Buddhists, Hindus and others and shows his great ignorance of Islam!
Irfan Yusuf (Muslim commentator, writer eg al-Age): Irfan’s attempt to blame ancient Indonesian culture for clitoridectomy is grossly offensive to the initial Buddhists, Hindus and others and shows his great ignorance of Islam!
Sherene Hassan (Heraldsun 20/6/07), Hanifa Deen (Age 30/5/07 p3 and Age, p 15 1/6/07) etc have already pushed the ‘clitoridectomy’ is an African problem, nothing to do with Islam lie! In Islam, clitoridectomy is supported by Mohammad in ahadith and Islamic laws (religious basis) and spreads worldwide with Islam--will we blame the natives of every country? Although not part of Christian teaching , a lower % of Christians (many Muslim converts) and some Animists in areas of Africa under Islamic control for 1300-1400 years with Islamic culture forced onto them also practice it (cultural basis). Our ‘western’ Muslims (and the PC people) are happy to slander others but lack the moral courage to face Islamic text, laws and practices!!!!
Is Irfan Yusuf aware that-
1) Islam’s text and laws support clitoridectomy: In Reliance of the Traveller, a classical manual of Islamic sacred law re 'circumcision' we find the Arabic actually says -
"Circumcision is obligatory (for every male and female) by cutting off the piece of skin on the glans of the penis of the male, but circumcision of the female is by cutting out the clitoris (this is called HufaaD). " (p59)(Shafi'i Law)
(Note the English version is falsely translated as 'prepuce ' of the clitoris!! Often used by Muslims to trick us!!)
Clitoridectomy is obligatory under Shafi Law (eg Egypt), sunna for Hanbalis and worthy of merit or a courtesy to the husband in other schools of law!"
Clitoridectomy is supported by several ahadith.
a) Abu-Dawud Book 41, No. 5251: Narrated Umm Atiyyah al-Ansariyyah: A woman used to perform circumcision in Medina. The prophet (peace be upon him) said to her: Do not cut severely as that is better for a woman and more desirable for a husband.
(Note:: The powerful Mohammad did NOT stop the procedure/clitoridectomy yet he stopped adoption when he wished to marry his adopted son's wife Zainab, regarded as incest by the Arabs because adopted sons were held as sons!)

b) Many ahadith across several sets cite Aisha re the need for ghusl when the 'two circumcised organs’ come in contact. Why would Aisha, Mohammad’s child bride talk of ‘the 2 circumcised organs’ contacting if she wasn’t ‘circumcised’! And Mohammad’s other wives-clitoridectomy was common?
Eg Muslim book 3 No. 684: Maliks Muwatta Book 2, Number 2.19.73 also 74, 75, 77 : And Maliks Muwatta Book 20 No. 20.46.161 ---very long, penalties for contact between a male and female during hajj including those circumcised parts!
c) some hadiths note "Cicumcision is a sunnah for Men, MAKRUMAH (noble deed, honourable) for women"
d) another hadith recounts an address to al-Ansar (Medina converts) women, endorsing female circumcision
Islamic laws and practices are based on the hadith and Koran. Despite a 19th century hadith revision, the clitoridectomy text remains!

Like the hajj ceremonies, clitoridectomy may have existed pre-Islam but was fully taken up by Mohammad and Islam-though thanks to other cultures, not always practised. Clitoridectomy will continue while Islam’s text/laws endorsing it remain unchallenged!
2) Prominent Muslims support it eg On 12/2/2007 Al-Arabiya TV aired 'Al-Azhar University Scholars Argue over the Legitimacy of Female Circumcision Practiced in Egypt.' Muhammad Al-Mussayar: notes "All the jurisprudents, since the advent of Islam and for 14 centuries or more, are in consensus that female circumcision is permitted by Islam. But they were divided with regard to its status in shari'a. Some said that female circumcision is required by shari'a, just like male circumcision. Some said this is the mainstream practice, while others said it is a noble act. But throughout the history of Islam, nobody has ever said that performing female circumcision is a crime. There has been a religious ruling on this for 14 centuries." ... "First of all, there are reliable hadiths in Al-Bukhari and Al-Muslim which support female circumcision....."Female circumcision is no less valid just because it was practiced in Pharaonic times and in the Jahiliya. Islam accepted some customs, which were harmonious with human nature, and rejected others, which contradicted human nature." (reported by http://MEMRI.org 27/2/2007 and FGM Network)
3) Australia’s mufti Sheik Fehmi al-Imam supports clitoridectomy: Re clitoridectomy : Sheik Fehmi al-Imam of the Preston Mosque replied to Pamela Bone "You probably don't need it but women in hot countries do"!!! (Melbourne Age 21/7/01 p7 Pamela Bone–also unaware clitoridectomy was endorsed in Islamic law)
Abc.net.au (11/5/06) and News.com.au note that over 50 females have been treated/year in Sydney hospitals following FGM. Some girls are sent overseas for the procedure but others are mutilated here.
4) Indonesian Muslims mutilate Christians: Christians of the Maluku islands Indonesia etc were not only attacked and killed by Muslims but those ‘converted’ to Islam on pain of death were subjected to clitoridectomy using their own kitchen knives! (Christina's Story; Sydney Morning Herald 27/1/2001; Conversion crusade rends the Spice Islands The Age 27/1/2001).
5) Indonesian Muslim groups support clitoridectomy: Assalaam Foundation treasurer Syarief Hamid, claims religion and the prevention of cervical cancer (Muslim abhorrence for any knowledge of female anatomy!!) are reasons to practise clitoridectomy! He says. "The religious view is, if you are not circumcised you won't have clean genitals after you urinate. If then you pray, your prayer won't be legal." The practitioners who came from the local hospital always cut a piece off the clitoris, he says. Masitoh Chusnan, from the women's wing of Muhammadiyah, one of Indonesia's two biggest Muslim organisations, says the circumcision of girls is regarded in Islam as an honourable practice. "The Hadith did not say it's obligatory, but it is recommended to have it done," she says. "There is the Prophet's words saying girls must be circumcised but you should not cut too much." !! (www.smh.co 13/1/04)
6) Muslims across a wide variety of ‘cultures, ’ ethnic groups, countries, continents continue to practice clitoridectomy after 1400 years—what they have in common is Islam! Many millions of females are mutilated and denied the right to full sexual pleasure!
As for those Muslims who endorse the ‘reduce but do not destroy’ view, the clitoris has more nerves than the head of the penis and also has a ‘shaft’ so would Muslim men like a chunk cut from the head of the penis or the whole penis trimmed!!! How about a ‘real trim’ Irfan, not just a little nip of some floppy skin....
I keep writing this because Muslims and involved others, too afraid to ‘upset’ Muslims, just don’t tell the truth
*********************************
And for the warbling Yusuf Islam recently portrayed on yet another Islam propaganda show on their ABC, Islam does forbid playing musical instruments...Bukhari Volume 7, Book 69, Number 494v: Narrated Abu 'Amir or Abu Malik Al-Ash'ari: that he heard the Prophet saying, "From among my followers there will be some people who will consider illegal sexual intercourse, the wearing of silk, the drinking of alcoholic drinks and the use of musical instruments, as lawful. ……Allah will destroy them during the night and will let the mountain fall on them, and He will transform the rest of them into monkeys and pigs and they will remain so till the Day of Resurrection."
*Laws: Reliance of the Traveller: r 40.0 Music, song, ..(Mohammad speaking) r40.40.1 p774, 775
(1) "allah mighty and majestic sent me as a guidance and mercy to believers and commanded me to do away with musical instruments, flutes, strings, crucifixes, …."
(2) "on the day of resurrection, allah will pour molten lead into the ears of whoever sits listening to a songstress."
(3) "song makes hypocrisy grow in the heart…"
(4) " This community will experience the swallowing up of some people by the earth, metamorphosis of some into animals, and being rained upon with stones." Someone asked "When will this be, o messenger of allah?" and he said "When songstresses and musical instruments appear and wine is held to be lawful."….
(“all of this is explicit and compelling textual evidence that musical instruments of all types are unlawful,” p775)
r40.2 p775 bans playing or listening to musical instruments but allows the tambourine at weddings…
r40.3 p775 bans singing or listening to singing even without musical instruments. Singing at weddings is considered sunna by some or if it urges followers to obey the sunna etc!
k2.3 p 382 It is invalid to transact something which is not useful…..such as vermin, a single grain of wheat or unlawful musical instruments. (can't sell/buy musical instruments..)
W52.1 (426-431) p989 playing stringed instruments; listening to them; playing reed instruments; listening to them; beating a long drum (kuba); or listening to it..(enormities! -seriously bad acts).
How much was he paid for this propaganda? No doubt he lives in luxury in Dubai, ignoring the slavery and millions living in massive slums! Keep smoking Yusuf but watch where you pluck! As for peace---unbelievable, what can you say!!!
References:
For text detail on FGM see any of the 3 articles on female genital mutilation on this site; refer to Answering-Islam or find some text HERE (sometimes modified or ‘explained’ in brackets to suit westerners!!)
Reliance of the Traveller, a classical manual of Islamic sacred law in Arabic with facing English text, commentary and appendices edited and translated by Nuh Ha Mim Keller (1994)
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Comments (14)


Circe,
It seems from your article that there's overwhelming evidence that fgm is Islamic. All the more reason therefore to deny it has anything to do with Islam.
The Home Secretary, UK, set a great example when she said that terrorism must be called anti-Islamic activities. Following this, fgm must be called anti-Islamic and the prohibition of musical instruments (for which you have provided compelling evidence) must also be called anti-Islamic.
Of course, we mustn't forget that beheading is anti-Islamic and all the other myriad atrocities carried out by the R of P!
Repeat after me: Islam is the Religion of Peace.
It seems from your article that there's overwhelming evidence that fgm is Islamic. All the more reason therefore to deny it has anything to do with Islam.
The Home Secretary, UK, set a great example when she said that terrorism must be called anti-Islamic activities. Following this, fgm must be called anti-Islamic and the prohibition of musical instruments (for which you have provided compelling evidence) must also be called anti-Islamic.
Of course, we mustn't forget that beheading is anti-Islamic and all the other myriad atrocities carried out by the R of P!
Repeat after me: Islam is the Religion of Peace.
1
March 20, 2008
Circe,
I was puzzled why Cat Stephens gave up playing music because it was un-Islamic, then resumed years later because it was OK.
Did he change his adviser, or did the Islamic powers decide he would be a good propaganda tool if he continued playing, and as we know, you can change any rule if it benefits Islam?
By the way, the picture of Yvonne Ridley shows her figure, which is surely haram. Why isn't she wearing a tent? And please cover her face (I'm beginning to understand the advantages of the niqab)
I was puzzled why Cat Stephens gave up playing music because it was un-Islamic, then resumed years later because it was OK.
Did he change his adviser, or did the Islamic powers decide he would be a good propaganda tool if he continued playing, and as we know, you can change any rule if it benefits Islam?
By the way, the picture of Yvonne Ridley shows her figure, which is surely haram. Why isn't she wearing a tent? And please cover her face (I'm beginning to understand the advantages of the niqab)
2
March 20, 2008
Yes, Circe, - there is clear hypocrisy and disinformation in attempts to disassociate FGM from Islam when there is ample evidence it has been part and parcel of Islam for a long time.
What gets me is everyone speaks in the name of 'real Islam' . But who knows what the REAL ISLAM IS? Music or no music.? FGM or no FGM? HIjab or niqab? Interest or no interest on a loan? Suicide bombing or no suicide bombing? Who is the judge of these things?
Yvonne of Arabia would look great on a camel- or maybe the camel would look great with her. And I like the pinocchio effect on Yusuf Islam, in the picture above, though some cat whiskers would add another bit of 'je ne sais quoi'.
What gets me is everyone speaks in the name of 'real Islam' . But who knows what the REAL ISLAM IS? Music or no music.? FGM or no FGM? HIjab or niqab? Interest or no interest on a loan? Suicide bombing or no suicide bombing? Who is the judge of these things?
Yvonne of Arabia would look great on a camel- or maybe the camel would look great with her. And I like the pinocchio effect on Yusuf Islam, in the picture above, though some cat whiskers would add another bit of 'je ne sais quoi'.
3
March 20, 2008

Wendy,
When it comes down to it, the real Islam must be the "morality" found in the Qur'an and hadiths.
Hence it's violent manifestation worldwide.
When it comes down to it, the real Islam must be the "morality" found in the Qur'an and hadiths.
Hence it's violent manifestation worldwide.
4
March 20, 2008
Definitely Irf Yusuf is wrong about FGM and Yusuf Islam about music.
Of course all these should be forgiven for they only lie to fulfil their duties in expanding the world of Allah and in expanding the Ummah.
I am not so sure about Ivonne. She is right about the music of course but to contradict men??!!!
And what is even worse by contradicting Yusuf Islam she exposes him to the Infidel in what he’s doing.
I’d say there is no punishment harsh enough to match her crimes.
Of course all these should be forgiven for they only lie to fulfil their duties in expanding the world of Allah and in expanding the Ummah.
I am not so sure about Ivonne. She is right about the music of course but to contradict men??!!!
And what is even worse by contradicting Yusuf Islam she exposes him to the Infidel in what he’s doing.
I’d say there is no punishment harsh enough to match her crimes.
5
March 20, 2008

I have just written and Emailed a reply to Dhimmi Ferguson, Mutliculti Minister, on behalf of the political party I am a member of (APP). I would like to post it here so that all can read and later would also post his reply, if he feels like giving me one, but after he reads what I have sent I doubt it!
But I don't know how to post. So can someone email me or leave a message here on what to do.
Terry.
Email This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it '> This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
But I don't know how to post. So can someone email me or leave a message here on what to do.
Terry.
Email This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it '> This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it
6
March 20, 2008
Circe, you keep posting these truths, please. Islam feeds on lies and misinformation. Your expose of the truths of Islamic "culture" are eye-opening.....and vital.
20 years ago I was prepared to accept Islam on it's own terms and by its own self-defining statements. It was only because other people showed me the bitter truth of Mohameds evil that I was able to see.
You are helping many in the same way.
20 years ago I was prepared to accept Islam on it's own terms and by its own self-defining statements. It was only because other people showed me the bitter truth of Mohameds evil that I was able to see.
You are helping many in the same way.
9
March 21, 2008
Rose, good point about Yvonne's shaky position! Fancy correcting a male! In public, too!
10
March 21, 2008
Mark Twain observed "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes."
It's certainly true that Islamic lies have travelled widely, largely because they are unopposed. In fact, there are many useful idiots who are prepared to help the lies on their travels.
However, by the same token, if we all get off our backsides and propogate the TRUTH, there's no reason why this shouldn't travel with equal speed.
It's certainly true that Islamic lies have travelled widely, largely because they are unopposed. In fact, there are many useful idiots who are prepared to help the lies on their travels.
However, by the same token, if we all get off our backsides and propogate the TRUTH, there's no reason why this shouldn't travel with equal speed.
11
March 21, 2008

Cassandra... Islam can change their law for convenience. I'm from Indonesia. Years ago, all the Islamic imams in Indonesia said a woman could not become president. But when Megawati, the daughter of the founding father of the nation, gained huge popularity to be the next president, these imams readily changed their tune: It's ok for a woman to be president, Islam says!!!
12
March 21, 2008
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